Sun

Oct 1
2006

Brady Forrest

Brady Forrest

I'm going to become a Fonero

I want WiFi everywhere. I want to be able to boot up my laptop anywhere and be able to connect from my neighborhood park. I want to be able to use Skype from the street. That's why I really like the idea behind FON, a wireless sharing startup, where members share each other's WiFi.

linus_alien_bill.gif

Most members (aka Foneros) "share their wireless Internet access at home and, in return, enjoy free WiFi wherever they find another Fonero’s Access Point", these are known as Linuses. Aliens do not share their WiFi and are charged for using the FON network. Bills do not take advantage of the free roaming WiFi and instead get a cut of the fees that Aliens pay to use their WiFi. This could subsidize the cost of your WiFi if your business or home is in a heavily trafficked part of town.

fonrouter.gif


To promote their service and assist willing wanna-be Foneros they are subsidizing a nice-looking WiFi router called La Fonera. Out of the box it supports broadcasting two SSIDs: a protected one for your home and a public one for your fellow Foneros. They are selling them for $5, but mine came to $14 with shipping to Seattle.

Right now there is only one FON access point listed near my house (you can check on their map to learn about your area). I'm hoping that this promotion will help, because right now the service is not of much use in Seattle.

[Found via webworkerdaily, Om's new blog for us work-at-home types]


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Comments: 35

  Eric D. Burdo [10.02.06 06:50 AM]

I recently became a Fonero. I have the WRT54G router (before the La Fonera came out).

There are about 5 people (me included) within a 50 mile radius of me. But for when I travel, having access to the internet for free is quite nice (I am a Linus).

  Easton Ellsworth [10.02.06 07:02 AM]

I'm intrigued. The "Linus-Bill-Alien" demarcations are clever.

  Roupen N. [10.02.06 10:56 AM]

What is going to become FON as muni-Fi's spin-up? I can see Linus' sharing their stuff but how will FON make money?

  John [10.02.06 11:26 AM]

I tried with the earlier software (may 2006) and I was very dissappointed.

No docs if your router did not start automatically
(eg no docs for main UK internet providers/typical issues)

I entered my zip/postcode code and it mapped it to another street with the same name.

Can you keep track of total downloads via your fonera? May be an issue for most of us.
Can you dynamically change bandwidth allocated to cope with this?

  brady [10.02.06 12:45 PM]

those are great questions. I intend to report back when i get an answer.

  Krish [10.02.06 01:25 PM]

I tried to ask my ISP (Comcast, Seattle) if using the FON router will break their terms. But I couldn't find a satisfying answer. If any of you have got a clear answer from your ISPs, lemme know. I would like to join FON but I am worried about breaking the terms.

  Martin Varsavsky [10.02.06 01:26 PM]

I am the CEO and founder of Fon. We apologize for the earlier version of our software, like most start ups we get better with time. Partly on our own, partly due to the advise of our partners at Google, Skype, eBay, Sequoia and Index Ventures but mostly due to the open source community that is frequently giving us ideas on how to make the fonero experience a better one. We are now subsidizing foneras and selling them only at $5 so early adopters can evolved from hacked Linksys to the real Fonero experience.

  Disappointed Fonero #23453 [10.02.06 02:36 PM]

Martin V. states that FON gets better...

>>mostly due to the open source community that is >>frequently giving us ideas on how to make the >>fonero experience a better one.

At the time being, the "Fonera" access point is closed source with an signed firmware image that prevents exactly that Open Source community to participate in the latest development.

Please see what dd-wrt author and ex-fon developer has to say about that:

http://www.dd-wrt.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=5083&highlight=fonera

Unlike Open Source communities, the attitude and support shown by FON towards it´s users is really a shame, refer to the FON user boards to get the message.

Being in a permanent beta state does not justify poor communication with the people that are supposed to make the global wifi happen, the foneros.

Disappointed Fonero #23453

  Jose del Moral [10.02.06 02:36 PM]

I am even more interested about Fon becoming a telecoms operator. Not just providing Internet access, but also voice thru VoIP mobile terminals.

  Steve [10.03.06 12:42 AM]

I wish the FON founder would tone down his politics. I was an early adopter but am afraid that my continued support for FON would be misinterpreted as support for his U.S.-bashing blather.
http://english.martinvarsavsky.net/

  Martin Varsavsky [10.03.06 01:04 AM]

Steve, I am sure that many other readers would probably find my politics, as described both in my blog and my foundations blog www.safe-democracy.org pretty reasonable. Yes, I do oppose the Bush Administration policies in the Middle East but I am clearly not the only one. I am also a trustee of the Clinton Foundation and yes, in the States I favor the Democratic Party. But whatever my politics I hope that you join Fon because you believe that sharing some occasional bandwidth at home and roaming the world for free is something you would like to do. You are welcome to promote the Bush administration using Fon as well!

  Mike [10.03.06 02:46 AM]

I think my question/comment was removed, could you please at least edit the parts that you do not consider appropriate, and specify why? I believe my point to be legitimate. Correct me if I am wrong, but my post was probably removed on request from Martin, as he somehow believes (he is wrong) that I am on a vendetta / smear campaign / call it what you will against Fon. Far from the truth.

Again: why is a Fon representative stating on the public forums that foneros that were the early adopters, who purchased the Linksys routers, and now would like the new Fonera, would have to keep both online for a year, in order to not violate Fon's Terms & Conditions? I believe if you fail to keep the subsidized router online for one year, the penalty is $45. Seems ilogical to have two routers at the same location hooked to the same broadband connection.

Regards,

Mike

  Paranoid Android [10.03.06 06:42 AM]

I agree, Mike just rants on and on and on he is biased, check his blog and see the reactions.

http://www.tech.am/

This Mike must be such a pain to FON and Martin. But now it seems the public can see WHY he does it. The company he works from what I read are making a clone or something in direct compotition to FON. Futher reading shows the owner of the company appears to be a FON reject.

Ban Mike's posts!

  Mike [10.03.06 07:29 AM]

These are the sort of comments made by people who have no clue, don't read and cannot tell fact from fiction. You are in The Matrix, and forgot to take the red pill. Ferran is not a Fon reject, he was supposed to be the CTO of the joint venture between Swisscom and Martin's investment company. When the two didn't reach an agreement, Martin carried on his own, and Ferran was out. It is as simple as that.

Exactly where have I disclosed what we are doing? Have I said anywhere that we are making a Fon clone? Ah, right...Martin said it, ergo it must be true. All I said is that it was a WiFi-related project, nothing else. From this, twisted conclusions have been drawn. Why don't you base your comment on fact, like I did with my analysis? Why don't you back your words with something?

  Paranoid Android [10.03.06 07:58 AM]

I comment on what I read on the web, and I do read your "facts" and I read other peoples views.

For a person that is a non FON user, etc, you now go off a disect their new router! Why would you want to do that, and how and where did you get it if you are not a FON member?

If Whisher (I believe this to be the name of your project from what I read, correct me if I am wrong) is NOT a Wi-Fi sharing project PLEASE publicly here say so. If it IS Wi-Fi sharing then it is a clone or similar to FON.

I am sure you will not answer this with a straight Yes or No answer.

PROVE that you are not biased!

  Mike [10.03.06 08:32 AM]

Thanks for a more balanced post. The Fonera was given to Ferran during a visit to Fon's HQ in Madrid last friday by Antonio Fuentes, who is Martin's right hand there. Ferran asked if he could have one to review, and he was given one. It is unfortunate that it was not working (this can happen, I will not start a rampage on one failed router), so we will have to order another to complete the review. I will first post a review on the hardware, followed by one on the functionality, range, etc. of the device.

If Fon is a WiFi sharing project, then Fon is a clone of AirBites, which is a clone of Joltage, which was a clone of MyZones, which...WiFi sharing is as old as WiFi itself. Fon is not new. Thus, even if Whisher was about WiFi sharing, would it automatically become a Fon clone? I very much doubt it.

I am completely sure that the hardcore followers will scream "clone!" as soon as we launch, but that is to be expected, even if from just a statistical perspective.

  Paranoid Android [10.03.06 08:41 AM]

Mike, please you STILL can't answer to information people request.

"I am sure you will not answer this with a straight Yes or No answer"

Again, I ask you, and I would appreciate a direct YES or NO answer to the following question:

"Is Whisher a Wi-Fi sharing project that would compete directly with FON?"

A simple yes or no will then direct the path of my next question to you.

  brady [10.03.06 08:42 AM]

Mike

I have not removed any comment of yours. Feel free to post. I do edit comments for spam, but never for content.

brady

  Mike [10.03.06 09:26 AM]

Hi Brady,

Thanks for your comment - I admit I may have rushed to conclusions too fast. Maybe the spam gremlins ate it - the repost is up there, so thanks again!

Regards,

Mike

  Mike [10.03.06 09:28 AM]

Paranoid:

No, Whisher is NOT a WiFi sharing project that would compete directly with Fon. As a matter of fact, it will be compatible with Fon (if Foneros want to use it), so don't panic.

Regards,

Mike

  Paranoid Android [10.03.06 10:09 AM]

Thanks Mike, so it IS a Wi-Fi sharing project, but in your view it will not compete with FON. This is how I read it.

So, my next question is why would you want to disect a FON router, if:

1) You are not a FON user anymore

2) The company you work for does not want to gain information / ideas / or discredit FON in anyway

3) That any 'findings' you make or claim to make really benefit who? The general public?

4) When you have have lost credibility for previous 'findings', why continue?

  peter [10.03.06 10:53 AM]

The next question should rather be:
Is la fonera based on openwrt / dd-wrt? Does it use iptables?
Where is the source code to the latest la fonera software?
This is what I would expect after taking input from the open source community. Contribute back to it!

  Mike [10.03.06 11:15 AM]

I'll reply to your points:

1) This is true.

2) This is also true. The fact that I disclosed in my blog that I work in a WiFi related project, and the fact that it is my own blog, not a company blog, should be enough for anyone to realize:

a) That I do not post lies. I post factual data, extracted after careful analysis and review.

b) That I express my own personal feelings and views, which based on my data, and how it blatantly contrasts with Fon's PR stance, are of course biased. Whenever you argue about anything you are biased. You are biased towards Fon right now with your questioning and remarks. Is my post about the lack of A2DP in Mac OS X also biased against the Mac? In that respect it is, because I am pissed off at Apple for not including what is a simple piece of firmware. But my posts are not unethical - they are backed with hard data. If I am critic, I will make sure I have backing, I won't go off making wild accusations against something or someone just because I don't like them.

3) Anyone who is even mildly interested in WiFi or other technologies. My review will be based on facts, again, extracted after careful analysis of the router. I will not comment on the functionality, range, features, etc. until I have a working unit, and can make a correct analysis. I will concentrate solely on the hardware.

There are many people out there interested in knowing more about the Fonera, for example, will it be re-flashable with customized firmware, as Martin promised? Or, as Brainslayer himself points out, it will have a cryptographic signature that will prevent non-Fon firmware from being loaded?

I like opening things up, studying them, modifying them, and since I have a blog, posting my findings. I am also ripping apart a Hipi VoIP phone, the review of which will be posted soon enough. Take a look at what I did with a WRT54G here:

http://www.sonar-security.com/wrt/

(Hint: it has a GPRS modem for backhaul/SMS, GPS and SD Card, plus customized LEDs). An article with full plans, schematics and parts list for making your own will also be posted soon.

I have been around WiFi almost since it was born, so anything related to it interests me, regardless of my professional situation - also, it angers me when the technology is misused.

4) Who says I have lost credibility? You? Who are you (I see you are still anonymous). Or is it Martin saying this? Who is Martin to judge anything, when he has attacked competitors on his blog, has deleted posts and censored comments as he has seen fit, and still hasn't answered my replies to his agressive post against me?

Credibility is gained by explaining the facts, not telling lies, and being ethical. However hard my post may be, I have not broken any of these. What is your argument, that I work for another WiFi related project? So what? That would actually make me even more qualified to comment, as it is my field of expertise. Had I told lies or twisted the factual data, I agree completely with you, I would have lost my credibility.

Unfortunately, this is not so, and I think Martin's acid reply, his flurry of post additions and removals, and the response from Fon's inconditionals, reinforces the fact that I must have hit a nerve somewhere. Possibly, the truth. I challenged Martin to prove my data was wrong, but he has not replied, at most he just says my analysis is wrong, without explaining why.

Regards,

Mike

  Fernando Lopez de Ayala [10.03.06 11:56 PM]

FON doesn't work at all! Just send a simple email to support@fon.com, and you'll find out what I'm telling you.

Besides that, do you really think that is it possible to build a worldwide WiFi network without investing a sigle US dollar in infrastructures?????

Please, check Martin Varsavsky's background, before you become a "fonero" and start "working for free"!!!!

  Michael Wolfgson [10.04.06 12:35 AM]

Just a question, Bradi.

Is it possible to share your broadband connection without the written permission of your ISP?

  Michael Wolfgson [10.04.06 12:56 AM]

And just another one.

Will I really benefit from other people´s WiFi without sitting on their porches?

  Mike [10.04.06 01:59 PM]

And curiously, nobody went up in flames at FON when such a direct shot was taken at the Bills model, and no uproar ensued.

To try to answer Michael's question, each ISP has a set of Terms & Conditions, which usually include severe clauses that forbid the sharing of your connection outside your home, be by running a cable to your neighbour, or running an open AP anyone can join. In certain countries, there are provisions in the law that could be interpreted as making broadband connection sharing illegal, and thus a crime (not just a breach of contract). This has yet to be tested in court, AFAIK.

If people don't believe some ISP are enforcing this, check out:

http://www.netstumbler.org/showthread.php?t=18116

and read the third post, by streaker69, where Cox's T&Cs are posted. There is an explicit mention to wireless technologies.

To cut a long story short: check with your ISP. It may be that they tolerate free sharing, but I think sharing for profit (by you or a third party) will not be tolerated - at least not if it becomes something big.

Regards,

Mike

  Cole kirk [10.09.06 02:45 AM]

If Whisher (I believe this to be the name of your project from what I read, correct me if I am wrong) is NOT a Wi-Fi sharing project PLEASE publicly here say so. If it IS Wi-Fi sharing then it is a clone or similar to FON.

Unfortunately, this is not so, and I think Martin's acid reply, his flurry of post additions and removals, and the response from Fon's inconditionals, reinforces the fact that I must have hit a nerve somewhere. Possibly, the truth. I challenged Martin to prove my data was wrong, but he has not replied, at most he just says my analysis is wrong, without explaining why.

  Christian carter [10.14.06 12:33 PM]

Exactly where have I disclosed what we are doing? Have I said anywhere that we are making a Fon clone? Ah, right...Martin said it, ergo it must be true. All I said is that it was a WiFi-related project, nothing else. From this, twisted conclusions have been drawn. Why don't you base your comment on fact, like I did with my analysis? Why don't you back your words with something?

  Liam Andersson [10.16.06 03:06 PM]

Wow, it's a lot of energy in this thread. Another clone selling prepaid surfcards based on home deployed AP is www.oxyfi.com. They claim they started 2003...

  David Tan [10.17.06 03:59 PM]

Let's not forget the La Fonera is a terrible deivce that is highly restrictive; most ports are blocked off, functionalities are zilch thanks to the lousy firmware (and the fact that it only accepts encrypted firmwares with Fon's signature and hence no DD-WRTs).

Until Fon brings back the subsidised WRT54Gs will it ever hope to become a success as the latter machine is a proper router, unlike the Fonera (which by the way only has no LAN ports! Ha!)

  Jan [11.03.06 02:53 AM]

I just found this on a German wireless forum.

If it is "Whisher" or a fake no I no.

http://img161.imagevenue.com/view.php?image=50398_whisher_122_536lo.jpg

Anyone know it is genuine?

  me [01.11.07 10:25 AM]

pure VAPORWARE

  Dan [01.30.07 05:54 AM]

actually it turns out that Whisher is not vaporware at all. we've been impressed.

  dudeasincool [01.30.07 06:12 PM]

I don't know what the fuss is all about. I downloaded Whisher today and have been testing it. Quite easy to use

http://www.whisher.com/en/faq.php

What's not to like? Let me know

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